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White noise blasts / Class action lawsuit.


thesecession

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Well this started happening to me as well as many others and after researching the issue it is obvious that Apple is well aware of it. They offer no warning whatsoever that this could happen and damage our hearing and gear even though they are now well informed of it. Start gathering your evidence with a DB meter and video recordings if its happening to you, as I am sure this will be a class action lawsuit in the future. I'll be chatting about it with a lawyer this week.
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...well, good luck with all that...your request/suggestion to "Start gathering your evidence with a DB meter and video recordings if its happening to you" would require an extraordinary amount of effort, in that the "events" are so random/infrequent/unpredictable. Including those who have reported being able to reliably reproduce examples; then someone else reports the exact same setup and gets "nothing."... :(

 

It does happen, and apparently not just on Mac. I've been dating on both sides of the fence. Soooooo, the best I've come up with is Ice9.../s~

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maybe, before calling a lawyer, start with something like ice9. and explore your 3rd-party plugins, see if perhaps you can narrow the issue down to something specific. only some logic users have experienced this, but no one seems to have locked down the cause. if it is a 3rd-party issue, no use chasing apple. (if)...

 

anyway, perhaps dealing with the issue is more productive than trying to start a lawsuit. just a thought...

Edited by fisherking
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Has *anyone* reported this white noise blast issue *using no third-party plugins* and only Logic itself?

 

In my experience, Logic is pretty solid in DSP (I recall one issue in the ES2 a decade or more ago), but I have indeed had third-party plugins behaving poorly or unpredictably in the past, and causing pops, killing the DSP engine, or other audio glitches. Logic can't really protect you from third-party code messing up.

 

Before "talking to lawyers", (because people do love to sue Apple as they have all the money), you really need to imo categorically eliminate whether this issue is caused by third-party plugins first.

 

If you can reproduce it running only Logic, without any third-party software on inbuilt Core Audio with no external audio interface, *then* you can start point the finger at Apple (or submitting a report, or engaging in a dialog, or slating them on social media, or employing lawyers, depending on where you are on the reasonable to aggressive scale.)

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Has *anyone* reported this white noise blast issue *using no third-party plugins* and only Logic itself?

 

In my experience, Logic is pretty solid in DSP (I recall one issue in the ES2 a decade or more ago), but I have indeed had third-party plugins behaving poorly or unpredictably in the past, and causing pops, killing the DSP engine, or other audio glitches. Logic can't really protect you from third-party code messing up.

 

Before "talking to lawyers", (because people do love to sue Apple as they have all the money), you really need to imo categorically eliminate whether this issue is caused by third-party plugins first.

 

If you can reproduce it running only Logic, without any third-party software on inbuilt Core Audio with no external audio interface, *then* you can start point the finger at Apple (or submitting a report, or engaging in a dialog, or slating them on social media, or employing lawyers, depending on where you are on the reasonable to aggressive scale.)

 

good points.

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if it is a 3rd-party issue, no use chasing apple. (if)...

 

That's not exactly true. I've seen other DAWs have issues like this in the past and each of them had to fix vulnerabilities in their audio engine that allowed 3rd party plugins passing erroneous data to send full-scale noise directly to the audio driver.

 

Saying "can you reproduce it without 3rd party plugins?" is sort of missing the point in my opinion. The plugin host should handle these failures more gracefully. If Steinberg and Presonus and Image Line have to deal with issues like this periodically in their DAWs, it only figures that Apple should too.

Edited by sunbrother
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if it is a 3rd-party issue, no use chasing apple. (if)...

 

That's not exactly true. I've seen other DAWs have issues like this in the past and each of them had to fix vulnerabilities in their audio engine that allowed 3rd party plugins passing erroneous data to send full-scale noise directly to the audio driver.

 

If Steinberg and Presonus and Image Line (etc etc) have to deal with issues like this periodically, it only figures that Apple should too.

 

do you have evidence of this, or is it anedotal? in other words which daws had to do this specifically? and, if, hypothetically, a specific 3rd-party plugin was the issue, it might make sense that it does, in fact, cause the problem in other DAWS; ie it could be the plugin, and not the DAW.

 

all i know is, there are facts, and there are anecdotes; and only facts are useful in such a situation. and no one seems 100% sure of what causes the issue...

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is it anedotal?

 

I beta test for various plugin devs and DAW makers so I can't divulge many specifics, but I can assure you that issues like this are usually caused by plugins and other hosts have had to build in safeguards for things like this for over the years. I'm not sure why some people take such issue with the host having to have some guardrails. Operating systems do the same thing.

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in which case, apple should do something; as long as they see what it is to do. and, personally, i still think that finding the cause would be more productive in the long-run than creating 'guardrails' for the issue.

 

anyway, have not experienced the blast, so will bow out of the conversation. but i hope some progress is made on this.

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The fact that users have to install an audio fuse to prevent real world damage on their ears and equipment is an absolutely massive one and legal action should be considered if you have provable damages.

 

Apple doesn't get to hide behind third party plugins being the culprit, the issue is too severe and they have to take action to make these noise bursts an impossibility in their software. At the very minimum they should make a statement warning people of this possibility with 3rd party plugins and letting us know of the ice 9 safety net.

 

An airhorn blast to the ear with lasting damage, if done on purpose would be considered felonious assault. It's not a joke, this problem could easily ruin lives and Apple is silent.

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...your problem is going to be proving foreknowledge/intent/blatant disregard. Sorry, that's gonna be tough...

Does it happen? There are reports, but not documented.

Can you consistently demonstrate the cause to be on the sole part of Apple, its representatives or agents? Sorry, that's gonna be tough...

Can you consistently demonstrate there was an intent or blatant disregard on the part of Apple, its representatives or agents? Sorry, that's gonna be tough...

Hey, I get you are pissed. The few times it has happened to me I would describe my reaction as "blind homicidal rage" as at the lower end of the emotional spectrum.

So in the meantime I pack my ears full of Ice9 and soldier on.../s~

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